FERNDALE ROBERTSES including Oliver Cromwell!

[ninian]

Hello
An ancestor of mine, James Roberts and his wife-to-be Elizabeth Jane (Lizzie) Hughes landed in Ferndale from Blaenau Ffestiniog sometime between 1901 & 1906. They married in 1906 in the Pontypridd District and by 1911 they were living in 30 Brown Street, Ferndale with their 2 sons, John James Roberts and Oliver Cromwell Roberts (the poor kid really was called that) and Lizzie's daughter Olwen Parry Hughes and Lizzie's brother Morris.
I haven't been able to find out anything more about them. Does anyone recognise any of their names?

I don't know Ferndale at all I'm afraid, so could anyone tell me if there is/was a baptist chapel in Ferndale (James was a baptist) and if there is a cemetery in Ferndale where they might be buried? I'd be grateful for any thoughts.

Ninian

[JohnPitt]

Hello
An ancestor of mine, James Roberts and his wife-to-be Elizabeth Jane (Lizzie) Hughes landed in Ferndale from Blaenau Ffestiniog sometime between 1901 & 1906. They married in 1906 in the Pontypridd District and by 1911 they were living in 30 Brown Street, Ferndale with their 2 sons, John James Roberts and Oliver Cromwell Roberts (the poor kid really was called that) and Lizzie's daughter Olwen Parry Hughes and Lizzie's brother Morris.
I haven't been able to find out anything more about them. Does anyone recognise any of their names?

I don't know Ferndale at all I'm afraid, so could anyone tell me if there is/was a baptist chapel in Ferndale (James was a baptist) and if there is a cemetery in Ferndale where they might be buried? I'd be grateful for any thoughts.

Ninian

Hi Ninian welcome to the forum and your interestingly named ancestors - can't help you there - sorry. Regarding Baptist churches there were Welsh and English in Ferndale/Blaen.
My mother belonged to the English Baptist chapel in Fountain Street - just 2 blocks up the road from Brown Street.


Welsh Baptist chapel was in Blaen


Overlooking the No 5 pit

[brianblaenboy]

Hi ninian, like John, can't help with the family. However, there is a Cemetery at the top end of Ferndale bordering Maerdy.
Also, there was one in Llanwonno which is on the the other side of the mountain which Blaenllechau was built on - my grandparents are there. The last time I was in Llanwonno, there was no way I could find my grandparents graves - overgrown is an understatement - but as it is isolated from the rest of the valley, that is not surprising. With regards to Ferndale - it is quite big but a step in the right direction could be the years your relatives died which could point to a certain area of the cemetery. Although I don't know when I am going down there this year, but I will try to learn more and post it here or pm you. Family research is harder than working!!

Brian

[bobtanner16]

there are 2 possible links to your james roberts in ferndale cemetery up until 1963,first is james roberts died 1921 aged 37 yrs
second is james roberts died 1956 aged 71 yrs,I can,t find any eliz, jane roberts ( if the first james died young aged 37 she may have remarried )just a thought
there is a john james roberts in ferndale cem he died 1909 aged 11months, also a oliver cromwell roberts there he died in 1910 aged 9 months there is also a eliz jane roberts same name as mother ( if same family ) she also died young 1908 3 months these may be linked to your names ,some ppl have put penrhys cemetery on the internet somewhere but i can,t find the link now .that is also local too .good luck in finding them

[lovelygirll]

Hi Ninian

I can't help with the family, but on the question of Baptist chapels, the one in Ferndale was called Salem Newydd and it was opposite to John's the booksellers. Sadly, it has been pulled down now but it was my chapel where I went to Sunday school for many, many years. Mr Handel Bowen was our Minister and the last I heard he was still alive but very poorly - he must be well into his 80's or 90's even.

[mamgu01]

Hello Lovelygirll.

My grand mother and cousin went to Salem Newydd, did you know them? my grandmother's name was Annie Llewellyn, and my
cousin was Agness Lewis, both of them were from Tylorstown.

[lovelygirll]

Hi Mamgu

No, sorry they don't ring any bells with me. However, I left Ferndale in 1966 and although i returned very often to stay with my family, I haven't been inside the chapel since my wedding day in 1967!

[ninian]

Wow - many thanks to everyone who responded. There's lots for me to get my teeth into here. I've decided I must have a trip to Ferndale (my first trip to the Rhondda fach). Although I'm from 'gogland' I now live in the Vale so it's not too far up to Ferndale to take some photos and to try and find the graves and chapels.

Could I ask a few more questions?

Q1. It sounds as if Brown Street is still there. On the map Ferndale doesn't look too big. Should I be able to find the street quite easily?

Q2. Am I right in thinking the Eng Bapt chapel is still there? I have John's photo, so I should be able to find it, if it is. Was Salem Newydd the Welsh Bapt chapel and that used to be in Blaenllechau but has now gone?

Q3. Are there 3 cemeteries I should look at? Is the Ferndale Cemy that has the graves for Oliver Cromwell etc the cemy that is at the top end of Ferndale by Maendy? Then there is a further cemy at Blaenllechau? - that place looks small enough on the map, so I should be able to locate that cemy easily? Then there is Penrhys Cemy - where is that one? Cos of your comments I shall have my wellies, waterproofs and a machete with me.

Q4. At least some of graves Bob listed are definately my family (there couldn't be 2 families with an Oliver Cromwell Roberts). However, the cemy sounds quite large. Can anyone say what my chances would be of finding the graves (if the headstones are still there) in a hours or two of searching? If it would be an impossible task I perhaps ought to try and find out if there is a burial index anywhere which has a plan of where the graves are before I go. I shall try and find that out anyway, I think.

My last question is in the hope that someone might be able to suggest what might be happening with my family. I just can't sort it out.
Here's the problem: Bob's info about the graves is really useful: If I can find the graves of the 2 James Robertses what is written on the headstones should hopefully give me enough info to know if it's the right family; also the headstone of the baby Elizabeth Jane. So that's straightforward enough. It's the graves of the 2 boys that are getting me confused. The graves of John James and Oliver Cromwell must be James and Lizzie's children. HOWEVER, Bob's info from the graves says that John James Roberts died in 1909 aged 11 months and Oliver Cromwell died in 1910 aged 9 months. But on the 1911 census James and Lizzie have 2 children, John J and Oliver C Roberts. John was aged 12 months and Oliver c aged 10 months. Something odd about that, for a start! At first I thought that as they had had 2 further boys they must have named them after the 2 boys that had died. Then I looked at the other info on the 1911 census and it recorded that James and Lizzie had had 3 children born alive; 2 children had died and only 1 child was still living .... but then the census recorded that 2 children were still alive (John J and Oliver C) at the time of the census. All very confusing. I've been looking on the freebmd site and there is a birth in 1908 and a death in 1909 for a John J, which ties in exactly with Bob's info. But there is no birth for a second John J in 1910, which would have tied in with the info from the 1911 census. Also on the freebmd site there is a birth for Oliver C Roberts - in Quarter 2 1910, so that ties in with the census but there is no record of a birth or death of an Oliver C in 1909/10 to tie in with Bob's grave info. What on earth is going on?? I can't figure it out. Could anyone take a guess?

[ninian]

UPDATE!

I've found Brown Street on google earth - so that answers my Question 1. Thanks to some very helpful people in the Cemeteries Dept at Pontypridd, a copy of a cemetery plan for Ferndale Cemy is now on its way to me. I'm hoping that this will help me locate the graves of Oliver Cromwell etc a bit quicker. Unfortunately I didn't think to ask them which was 'Ferndale Cemy'. Is it the one at the top by Maendy or Penrhys, I'm assuming it isn't the Llanwonno one? As soon as I get the Cemy Plan I will be heading for Ferndale .....

[darran]

Ferndale Cemetery is the one between Ferndale and Maerdy.

Sheila